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cartoonist
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Oct 06, 2012 (06:26 AM)
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Joined:
Jul 07, 2012
Age: 57
Gender: Female
Country: Canada
Occupation: Children's Book Illustrator
Hobbies: Vegetable Gardening, Koi Pond, Reading, Fishing
748347
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One of the most nonsensical scenario's around the smoking ban I had ever heard of was, that the federal government buildings still had ventilated smoking rooms, while everywhere else smoking was banned to the great outdoors (and even outdoor smoking shelters were being banned) !!!
OMG! There were even air quality tests conducted outside of the smoking rooms in the buildings to, I guess, prove that the ventilated rooms were working fine and that second hand smoke outside of them was not an issue.
Hard to justify some old vet wheeling out in minus 30 to have a smoke while a fed sits in a lounge... ah yes, the mind boggles.
I can't say for sure that they are even gone yet, though they were calling for their closer in the summer of 2007. I would hope they are gone by now!!! Not sure about Parliament though:)
Justave, you made some great points and I'm in agreement. The bans have made it much easier for us to quit. I applaud those that quit while people were still allowed to smoke EVERYWHERE. Can you imagine the willpower one would need back in the 70's for instance???
My Milage:
My Quit Date: 7/16/2012
Smoke-Free Days: 82
Cigarettes Not Smoked: 2,296
Amount Saved: $918.40
Life Gained:
Days: 11 Hrs: 11 Mins: 2 Seconds: 8
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Justave
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Oct 05, 2012 (08:08 AM)
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Joined:
Aug 21, 2012
748262
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Hi all
I think we have to remember that main driver for forcing people outside of buildings (and now 15 feet away from the entrance) is a matter of organizational liability. If a business, hospital, government office or the like do not force smokers outside, not only to they break the law (just or not) but they put them selves at risk of millions of dollars in law-suits should a non-smoker claim a smoking related illness from second hand smoke. Once the link was made from second hand smoke and illnesses, the law became stronger (to protect the government's liability) and organizations strengthend their rules (to protect their liability).
Law suits are a major concern for all organizations.
I agree that they could have thought it through better, to allow inside ventilated smoking rooms in hospitals for older people who can't/won't quit, that would have been more reasonable....BUTT.....I have to admit, the idea of having to go outside in rain and snow this coming winter is to some degree a factor in my quitting....so maybe it is a good thing.
In hospitals in particular there are many medications which are dramaticly affected by smoking. Some years ago I was on a medication which did not work and my doctor told me to stop smoking (which I did for 2 weeks) and the medication started to work right away. Smoking doesn't just kill you in the end - it suppresses your immune system and counteracts medications intended to help you recover from an illness - does logic stand that if someone is in hospital to get treatment that the same hospital should "facilitate" the use of a harmful substance which counteracts all their efforts?
The next generation, little kids are also seeing the treatment of smokers, huddled outside in little packs, puffing away, and they recognize that this is not a desirable way to be, so maybe it helps the next generation to be smoke free....certainly the statistics show it is working.
Gentle, thoughtful, considerate, maybe not but we have to remember that smoking kills everytime its just a matter of how long for each person.
Sorry, don't mean to be preachy, but this is killing people and if it was more visible, if it was a virus which was killing thousands of Canadians every day - would we feel differently?
My Milage:
My Quit Date: 9/8/2012
Smoke-Free Days: 27
Cigarettes Not Smoked: 675
Amount Saved: $270.00
Life Gained:
Days: 4 Hrs: 10 Mins: 54 Seconds: 14
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yay me
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Sep 27, 2012 (08:42 PM)
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Joined:
Aug 26, 2012
Gender: Female
Country: Canada
Hobbies: living smoke freeeeeee
747808
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I don't know what makes me sadder....that when it was realized how lethal the smoking habit is (both first n second hand) it was not outlawed (of course $ lost as a result is the deciding factor, NOT people's health grr) or the fact that now quitting smoking aids is a money making machine (why are nrts not FREE?????) AND they're still making katrillions off of individuals enslaved by the nicodemon. So yes we live in a society that worships the almighty $. Cigarettes are legal but you are incredibly poo poohed by society if you do smoke and treated like a leper (ie poor injured/hospitalized/ elderly with limited mobility having to choose between travelling to Timbuktu for a smoke or forced to quit)...and at the end of the day its non smokers have all the rights and freedoms whereas to smoke means you give them all up annd are at the mercy of not only your addiction but also what the rest of the world decides when you only smoke because it is only available at the hand of a government who's fault it is you're ever lured in and enslaved IN THE FIRST PLACE ?!!??!!!! *Sigh* glad to be on this journey....if you can't beat em join em lol and I refuse to give the government 1 more red cent to guarantee my early death chalk full of suffering!
My Milage:
My Quit Date: 9/24/2012
Smoke-Free Days: 3
Cigarettes Not Smoked: 75
Amount Saved: $30.00
Life Gained:
Days: 0 Hrs: 6 Mins: 42 Seconds: 5
if youre going thru hell, keep going 
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cartoonist
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Sep 27, 2012 (08:07 AM)
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Joined:
Jul 07, 2012
Age: 57
Gender: Female
Country: Canada
Occupation: Children's Book Illustrator
Hobbies: Vegetable Gardening, Koi Pond, Reading, Fishing
747741
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I'd love to see the governement up the SIN tax even more on cigarettes (and on booze too) but the governement tried that before. I remember when the sin tax skyrocketed and suddenly there was a booming illegal cigarette trade being smuggled out of the reserves. The cartons where 1/4 of the price of the stores and the government paniced at the loss of taxes and had to reduced their price by half to try and stop it. The governments in sort of a rock and a hard place. I do wish they would use some of the cig taxes to fund more support groups for those that wish to quit. I remember spending forever on line looking for such a group I could join in my area, but came up with nothing. There were specific groups, such as single parent, low income, native, teen but I didn't fall into any of the catagories:( Thank HEAVEN there is the CCC and SHO!!!!
Personally I'd love to see the government slap sin tax on fast food/junk food too. If a McD's burger cost $10 ($20 to make that a combo:) people would think twice about feeding it to their children other then as a treat, special outing:)
Seriously though, obesity and it's many related (and VERY costly to our health care) illnesses have almost surpassed those brought on by smoking.
(but that's a whole other addiction:)
I am completely FOR making it harder and harder to find places for the average population to smoke. I agree with Violet that it was a large part of my reason to quit. It's no fun to be the one that has to go outside in minus 30 and walk a block away from a doorway and THAT'S the way it should be for the majority of us.
I still feel awful bad for those old vets though, I think there should be some exceptions for outdoor shelters in these cases, at least till the old fellas are gone.
My Milage:
My Quit Date: 7/16/2012
Smoke-Free Days: 73
Cigarettes Not Smoked: 2,044
Amount Saved: $817.60
Life Gained:
Days: 10 Hrs: 5 Mins: 10 Seconds: 54
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braveheart
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Sep 27, 2012 (12:46 AM)
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Joined:
Apr 25, 2006
Age: 57
Country: Canada
Occupation: Retired
Hobbies: Volunteering, comedy, travel, family
747724
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This is indeed a divisive topic Matt. I don't blame anyone, especially those early in their quits, that needs to demonize smoking and extend that to smokers themselves. Please use that you need to in order to keep the quit! If that is what it takes I would in fact encourage it. After all that is what we are all aiming to do here.  I was what might be described as a considerate smoker. I have witnessed far too many who are anything but! I guess it is hard to distinguish between the two for some. I do feel sorry for my own friends that have not been able to break free of the addiction and yet are treated with contempt for partaking in a still legal habit in designated areas. As far as hospitals are concerned, as I mentioned I volunteer at one and these designated smoking areas that have been established give a place for patients and visiting family members to "feed the need" yet be well removed from the general public and staff but not standing on the street corner in plain view of everyone to see. Withdrawal symptoms for patients affect them in the same manner as it did for all of us. The difference is that there is little if any assistance offered, while most patients are not yet ready to call it quits. The hospitals also have a inherent risk by having patients leaving the physical property especially with their I.V.'s in tow. This is a problem that requires a small measure of compassion and a large dose of common sense to resolve! While I honestly would have much preferred the sale of tobacco to have been made illegal 40 years ago this is just my opinion based on the realities of today. 
My Milage:
My Quit Date: 4/18/2008
Smoke-Free Days: 1623
Cigarettes Not Smoked: 45,444
Amount Saved: $18,177.60
Life Gained:
Days: 295 Hrs: 21 Mins: 21 Seconds: 47
Your choice... be free!
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violet56
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Sep 26, 2012 (11:09 AM)
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Joined:
Jun 12, 2006
Age: 57
Gender: Female
Country: Canada
Occupation: Customer Service
Hobbies: Photography,writing,reading
747685
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Hi Braveheart I personally never had a problem with all the restrictions because I always realized my addiction could hurt anyone standing in my vicinity because of the second hand smoke. (worse than herion or cocaine in that way). I also appreciated that I noticed I smoked much less because of it. Perhaps they are still not doing enough, they should double the prices further, make ALL public areas smoke free. What ever it takes Braveheart to end the rule of nicotine and let everyone take back their lives. It is a statement in itself as to how strong of an addiction nicotine is that there are people standing out in the middle of winter in their hospital gowns  I feel no need to make it easier for them as it doesn't help them to make it easier to get their fix. It " should" be HARD to find somewhere to smoke...especially after reading about all the loss of loved ones suffered by the members just on this site alone :-( You have a big heart Braveheart and I appreciate your compassion , but in this particular instance I think the freedom and rights of smokers "always" infringes on the freedoms and rights of everyone that doesn't smoke. It's the nature of smoking that the second hand smoke travels and travels far so you just can't escape it unless you take a completely different route and even that isn't a guarantee, where is the right of the children passing by to not be exposed ? SIGH... There is no quick or easy answer for sure. I so wish the tobacco companies would get sued enough that they went out of business or that some horrible disease would strike down tobacco plants all over the world. Three days of withdrawal and the world would be free 
My Milage:
My Quit Date: 7/25/2012
Smoke-Free Days: 63
Cigarettes Not Smoked: 945
Amount Saved: $378.00
Life Gained:
Days: 8 Hrs: 17 Mins: 39 Seconds: 51
It's never too late to be what you might have been
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Matt, Moderator
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Sep 26, 2012 (10:20 AM)
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Joined:
Jul 30, 2012
747681
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Hey Braveheart,
You are definitely right in that society/governments, not just in Canada, but all over the world have been slowly changing their tone on what is allowed, places to smoke, and how they present smoking.
Like everything there are both sides.
For one, you have an individual's legal personal choices being scrutinized in many different ways. The other side seems to be that the stance taken is warranted in that the health care costs of a person engaging in a preventative unhealthy behaviour is weighing down the health care system of a nation.
Thanks for your opinion, I tend to lean more to the second camp, but of course their are many moral/ethical/philosophical stances from both sides.
It will be interesting to see where things go in the future.
Interesting debate none the less.
Members, should you comment, please continue to keep the debate "non-confrontational" as both sides of this debate have valid points.
Matt, Moderator
The Smokers' Helpline Online Support Team
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cartoonist
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Sep 26, 2012 (07:12 AM)
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Joined:
Jul 07, 2012
Age: 57
Gender: Female
Country: Canada
Occupation: Children's Book Illustrator
Hobbies: Vegetable Gardening, Koi Pond, Reading, Fishing
747668
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braveheart, I am SO in your camp. I remember last winter walking by the Vets hospital and seeing a small group of men, in their wheelchairs, blankets thrown over their shoulders, shivering and having a smoke. It was like they were back in the fox holes again, smoking in minus 20 weather. And... the purose of this is???
What, we need to prolong the lives of 80 year old men in poor health AND deprive them of perhaps the only thing they can now do??? I doubt there are any nurses there that like the rules either. They too have to go outside in this weather to help the men in and out. It becomes a comedy of the absurd. On the flip side, the government makes sure that native americans can smoke, basically, for free. What does that say about the value we put on our native populations.
Things go from one extreme to another and very seldom make any sense at all.
My Milage:
My Quit Date: 7/16/2012
Smoke-Free Days: 72
Cigarettes Not Smoked: 2,016
Amount Saved: $806.40
Life Gained:
Days: 10 Hrs: 1 Mins: 42 Seconds: 39
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braveheart
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Sep 25, 2012 (11:51 PM)
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Joined:
Apr 25, 2006
Age: 57
Country: Canada
Occupation: Retired
Hobbies: Volunteering, comedy, travel, family
747651
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I am a non-smoker. I am very proud of that fact, after many attempts, still able to call myself that. Yet, I still get annoyed when I see things in the news or simple things that berate and demean smokers as if they have the plague. I certainly do not want to sit in the middle of a crowd of smokers, but I don’t want them barred from the planet simply because of a legal addiction they partake in. Couple of items in today’s news. Firstly a hospital in N.S. that is being forced by the Province to create a smoking area on-site for patients (a psychiatric hospital). Patients there before had to get a 1 hour pass to go off the grounds to light up. With 17% of Canadian teens to adults still addicted why is it so politically incorrect to reach some kind of compromise. I volunteer at a local hospital and they have seen the negative image that came from having patients wearing gowns and on I.V.’s standing on the sidewalks off the hospital property smoking presents to the community. This went on for several years but now they have created on-site outdoor designated smoking areas that provide some measure of comfort and minimal shelter for those not yet ready to quit. The second item that struck me today was a warning on a movie that I was interested in seeing. It was not violence or nudity that was the warning… but “tobacco use”! Not the first time I likely saw this warning, but the first time I really took noticed of it. Society has done a great job at demonizing smoking. I honestly believe that one person’s habit should not negatively affect another person. At the same time though it is cruel and unjust to demonize the smoker.
My Milage:
My Quit Date: 4/18/2008
Smoke-Free Days: 1621
Cigarettes Not Smoked: 45,388
Amount Saved: $18,155.20
Life Gained:
Days: 295 Hrs: 16 Mins: 49 Seconds: 10
Your choice... be free!
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